Demiurge. In Young Avengers vol. @killianduclark: Thats not even remotely debunking anything. When it is employed by other Gnostics either it is not used in a technical sense, or its use has been borrowed from Valentinus. In the future, Wiccan will become the Demiurge, a singular multidimensional Messiah, according to Loki. He looks at all of reality beneath his feet, Returns to his main body from infinite realities, Scan this QR code to download the app now. 15). He has received some form of training from Loki during his time in the Young Avengers. You then who are spiritual should worship neither the creation nor the Craftsman, but the Father of Truth. In one of the many dark possible futures shown to Immortus by The Time Keepers; William and Thomas had become tyrannical God-like superhumans who were seen launching a devastating assault on Eternity in an attempt to overthrow him. When Norman Osborn invaded Asgard with his army of superpowered beings and H.A.M.M.E.R. Loki literally says "you're gonna rewrite the laws of magic across all realities". They go to the Uncanny Avengers for help, but they too fall under the influence of the parasite. They are rescued by Noh-Varr and Kate Bishop, and the team flees to Central Park in order to avoid bringing too many people into the spell. When his powers first manifested, he nearly killed someone. He avoided Kessler at all costs until one day he saw Kessler had found a new victim. The team defeat the creature, but Wiccan's spell is still in tact. send you an email once approved. He started out in the Young Avengers with the code name Asgardian, using only lightning powers. Plotinus sought to reconcile Aristotle's energeia with Plato's Demiurge,[5] which, as Demiurge and mind (nous), is a critical component in the ontological construct of human consciousness used to explain and clarify substance theory within Platonic realism (also called idealism). How is it likely that shes not lying when the demiurge is still a thing everywhere else? Demiurge, under Mor-I-Dun's control, attacked the Avengers and his husband, King Hulk . Around the time the two boys are physically 10, they begin to display superpowers, with Tommy having inherited his uncle Pietro's super speed and Billy displaying magical powers similar to the ones used by his mother. Evangeliou, "Plotinus's Anti-Gnostic Polemic and Porphyry's Against the Christians", in Wallis & Bregman, From "Introduction to Against the Gnostics", Plotinus', Armstrong, pp. He briefly achieves this form, and is able to view the past, present and future, as well as freely alter the universe. Of course, their threats were played off and ignored. All those statements are never verified when they were not outright contradicted or retconned. @j2111: Hi may I ask where you got these 4th and 5th scans from? During this battle, Billy revealed his ability to cast spells where he had previously limited himself to lightning projection and flight due to his inexperience. @demiurgekaplan: the entirety of multiversal demi urges feats come from statements about creating the utopia parallel. Wiccan's magic is similar to his mother's, the Scarlet Witch. 3. The Demiurge regretted even its slight imperfection, and as he thought himself the Supreme God, he attempted to remedy this by sending a Messiah. He has received two figures to date, one of which depicted his most well known costume, and the other of which depicted his original Asgardian outfit. The earliest Gnostic sects ascribe the work of creation to angels, some of them using the same passage in Genesis. The work of Plotinus and other later Platonists in the 3rd century AD to further clarify the Demiurge is known as Neoplatonism. The story isnt finished yet and theres multiple things pertaining her previous origin to even consider this an actual sound recton. What's more likely is that you are in deniable. After a possessed Scarlet Witch and Doctor Doom cast the Inversion spell again, the "evil" heroes reverted to their heroic selves, and the trapped Avengers were freed. "Matter is therefore a non-existent"; Plotinus, "Apocryphon of John," translation by Frederik Wisse in. This edit will also create new pages on Comic Vine for: Until you earn 1000 points all your submissions need to be vetted by other As "Asgardian" he limited his abilities to that of flight and lightning projection. [28], Opinions on the devil, and his relationship to the Demiurge, varied. And how many more times to I have to tell you the visual depiction of interacting with comic panels does not matter? "[47], Catharism apparently inherited their idea of Satan as the creator of the evil world from Gnosticism. Billy used his magical abilities to send Sentry away, taking Osborn's most valuable team member off the board. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. The true Platonic other-worldliness, which love and venerates the material universe in all its goodness and beauty as the most perfect possible image of the intelligible, contracted at length with the false, Gnostic, other-worldliness which hates and despises the material universe and its beauties (chs. She was playing with them when Doctor Strange met her in the tower. [34], The angelic name "Ariel" (Hebrew: 'the lion of God')[35] has also been used to refer to the Demiurge and is called his "perfect" name;[36] in some Gnostic lore, Ariel has been called an ancient or original name for Ialdabaoth. When Loki teleports away, seemingly abandoning the team, Wiccan sees no choice but to kill himself in order to end his spell, but is saved by Loki's return. As he writes in his commentary on John 4:21. While being attacked, Billy's powers manifested for the first time. After a dangerous and adventure-filled trip through the multiverse, the team ventures to Mother's dimension to rescue Teddy. The Demiurge will rewrite the rules of magic and all the implications of that decision will echo forward and backward across all realities. There the boys encountered Master Pandemonium who further strengthened their belief that they are the reincarnated souls of the Scarlet Witch's twin sons. The idea of Demiurge was, however, addressed before Plotinus in the works of Christian writer Justin Martyr who built his understanding of the Demiurge on the works of Numenius.[12]. and apparently if he can't hear himself chanting the spell, it won't cast. Some readers believed the twins Malachi and Tobias to have been the kidnapped children of the Scarlet Witch and Vision. Something being made from a gods breath is standard prose about creation. It was in this moment that Osborn called in the big gun. Dude The Unkindness negs I can break this down if you want, and I talked too both authors . Though the former understanding certainly enjoys the greatest popularity, the identification of Plotinus' opponents as Gnostic is not without some contention. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. The Super-Skrull killed Hulkling's foster mother and captured Hulkling to his ship to take him back to the Skrull Empire. Wiccan and Hulkling from this reality, also known as Earth A, came to Earth-616 as tourists, and for some reason they registered in the Initiative. forces, the heroes of Earth went to its rescue. Sophia (Greek: , lit. Like many other heroes, Wiccan and the Young Avengers were granted amnesty following the conclusion of Civil War. All realities mean omniverse. Plotinus' form of Platonic idealism is to treat the Demiurge, nous, as the contemplative faculty (ergon) within man which orders the force (dynamis) into conscious reality. 2 yr. ago. The one also in Immortal Wonder Woman? Armstrong alluding to Gnosticism being a Hellenic philosophical heresy of sorts, which later engaged Christianity and Neoplatonism.[53][54]. 1. The team confronted the Super-Skrull and freed Hulkling. No she's above Hectate the goddesses of magic in the multiverse . Their search took them to various significant locations to the Scarlet Witch, finally ending at the former home that she shared with the Vision. Thus, a triad is formed of the intelligible nous, the intellective nous, and the psyche in order to reconcile further the various Hellenistic philosophical schools of Aristotle's actus and potentia (actuality and potentiality) of the unmoved mover and Plato's Demiurge. In the show, Wanda gives birth to Billy and his twin brother Tommy after moving to Westview to start a new life with Vision. However the utopian parallel was still created by the demiurge. Here, at the summit of this system, the Source and Demiurge (material realm) coexist via the process of henosis. During this time, the Super-Skrull stated his belief that Billy and Tommy's similarities in appearance and powers indicated that they were the twin sons of the Scarlet Witch and the Vision. [28][42] And as Achamoth herself was only the daughter of Sopha the last of the thirty Aeons, the Demiurge was distant by many emanations from the Propatr, or Supreme God. The Valentinian Heracleon[46] interpreted the devil as the principle of evil, that of hyle (matter). Outside, Magneto arrives, saying that he wants Billy help to locate his daughter. Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. When he does, multiple fights break out between the various groups trying to capture the Scarlet Witch. A partially powered Demiurge (aka the Semiurge) holds off Mother's attacks Fully turns into the Demiurge through the power of love As the full-powered Demiurge, he casually removes Mother from existence, who is an extremely powerful matter manipulator, and removes everyone from the pocket dimension into the main universe. Once Scarlet Witch had heard the full story of his troubles at school, she told him that next time he was threatened the best thing to do would be to stand up to Kessler. Wiccan and the rest of the Young Avengers (excluding Stature) decided not to register, Hawkeye and Patriot serving with the underground resistance team known as the Secret Avengers. We dont know if shes telling the truth, so as of now its HAS NOT BEEN recton cause the story hasnt even given a chance to prove if shes telling the truth in the first place. Transforms himself into the Scarlet Witch, Conjures up clothes in order to look like a prison guard, Gives Kid Loki a teenage body, making Loki even stronger, Undoes the Enchantress' transformation spell. Team Affiliations: Young Avengers, New Avengers/AIM (soon). Billy experiments with some names, adopting the name Demiurge, but later reverts back to Wiccan. I made The respect threads , and I'm telling you the unkindness is a problem. Thats a cute post though. Several systems of Gnostic thought present the Demiurge as antagonistic to the will of the Supreme Being: his act of creation occurs in an unconscious semblance of the divine model, and thus is fundamentally flawed, or else is formed with the malevolent intention of entrapping aspects of the divine in materiality. He should win here. The true doctrine of Soul (ch. In the report of the system of Basilides,[23] we are told that our world was made by the angels who occupy the lowest heaven; but special mention is made of their chief, who is said to have been the God of the Jews, to have led that people out of the land of Egypt, and to have given them their law. Wiccan continued as a member of the Young Avengers (now including Tommy as "Speed") until the events of Civil War and the Superhero Registration Act forced the team to go underground as part of Captain America's anti-registration team of superheroes. In the Archontic, Sethian, and Ophite systems, which have many affinities with the doctrine of Valentinus, the making of the world is ascribed to a company of seven archons, whose names are given, but still more prominent is their chief, "Yaldabaoth" (also known as "Yaltabaoth" or "Ialdabaoth"). Wiccan can rewrite the rules of magic across all realities. I don't know why people saying he is multiversel, etc. However, at this point in time, Wiccan doesn't have sufficient control over his powers to fully utilize the Demiurge's powers. In the Nag Hammadi text On the Origin of the World, the three sons of Yaldabaoth are listed as Yao, Eloai, and Astaphaios.[31]. Are they confirmed it or hinted about it? [49] In the ninth tractate of the second of his Enneads, Plotinus criticizes his opponents for their appropriation of ideas from Plato: From Plato come their punishments, their rivers of the underworld and the changing from body to body; as for the plurality they assert in the Intellectual Realmthe Authentic Existent, the Intellectual-Principle, the Second Creator and the Soulall this is taken over from the Timaeus. Demiurge Wiccan has more impressive feats. In order to test if his feelings are genuine, the two agree to temporarily break up. This process takes no more than a few hours and we'll All traits of a character are used for calculating the Classification. Demiurge. During her marriage to the Vision, the Scarlet Witch used her reality-altering powers to create twin boys Willaim and . 13). In the theoretic of Plotinus, nous produces nature through intellectual mediation, thus the intellectualizing gods are followed by a triad of psychic gods. This link to Judeo-Christian tradition leads to a further comparison with Satan. Another alternative title for the demiurge is "Saklas", Aramaic for "fool". Thus the real Hulkling (disguised as the Super-Skrull) was able to stay on Earth. Demiurge Wiccan has more impressive feats. Billy's issues escalated as he grew older and entered high school where his differences became the source of endless torment and violence. And as I said before get over the visual depiction we've seen Dice(Skrull Kill Krew) interact with them and he is not even as powerful as standard Wiccan. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Generally though, I'd agree with the take that trying to compare the power of two nebulously defined reality warpers is a bit silly. (Kick Duck Dancing) 16:52 GG - Petrivka 19:49 Daniel Christian ft. Kolly Dee - Slava Ukraine 23:19 Andrew StetS feat. Doctor Strange has also claimed that Wiccan has the potential to be the next Sorcerer Supreme. The Young Avengers and the Super-Skrull fled the Kree. Gnosticism attributed falsehood or evil to the concept of the Demiurge or creator, though in some Gnostic traditions the creator is from a fallen, ignorant, or lesserrather than evilperspective, such as that of Valentinius. The Neoplatonic philosopher Plotinus addressed within his works Gnosticism's conception of the Demiurge, which he saw as un-Hellenic and blasphemous to the Demiurge or creator of Plato. Honestly Wiccan is mostly statements. With that Osborn took his leave, and left the team alone. Mother is defeated, and all theteen heroes gather at MJ's Club to celebrate the new year. Billy was impressed with the magical capabilities of Sylvie Lushton, aka Enchantress. Character This article is about philosophical concept of a Universal Fashioner. Flabbergasted, he then admitted that she was his favorite Avenger. The battle culminated with Iron Lad killing Kang which altered the past and present. For Billy to activate his reality-bending magic, He must focus on a desire or idea and vocalize, repeating quickly what he wants in order for a spell to be cast. Under the name of Nebro (rebel), Yaldabaoth is called an angel in the apocryphal Gospel of Judas. The two work out their problems, and their love is able to save the universe. This type of spellcasting has its flaws obviously. Am not jumping the gun, am presenting the evidence as is. In a fight with Doctor Doom, both Cassie and Vision are killed. In the arch-dualist ideology of the various Gnostic systems, the material universe is evil, while the non-material world is good. For other uses, see. Later on, he started using magic and could perform all kinds of spells. Wiccan can augment his strength through magic. A. H. Armstrong identified the so-called "Gnostics" that Plotinus was attacking as Jewish and Pagan, in his introduction to the tract in his translation of the Enneads. To Plotinus, the second emanation represents an uncreated second cause (see Pythagoras' Dyad). Raven as the unkindness absorbed infinite planes, timelines, multiverse, gods etc Point blank, "the author confirmed on Twitter that the transformation lightning of the Wizard couldn't even harm the Unkindness, it's basically unstoppable and it's implied that Adam needs to travel back in time to prevent Raven from getting these powers. The two sides clashed until the battle was ended by Captain America's realization that their position was being fought in a manner that only endangered more citizens. 6). He briefly achieves this form, and is able to view the past, present and future, as well as freely alter the universe. Magic/Reality-Warping: Billy's main power is the superhuman ability to manipulate reality at will, enabling him to tap into the universe's store of magical energies, which he inherited from his spiritual mother the Scarlet Witch. It's unclear whether or not he used magic to defend at all. He also is vitally important in Avengers: Children's Crusade (which is more or less an unofficial volume of . The philosophical usage and the proper noun derive from Plato's Timaeus, written c.360 BC, where the demiurge is presented as the creator of the universe. While still trying to decide how to continue their activities while staying under the radar of the New Avengers, Hulkling was kidnapped by the Super-Skrull. The Demiurge who created the elder gods is not even the same entity, as the writer who came up with this nonsense for Wiccan confirmed, the great old ones that pic talks about appear to be the many-angled-ones, who are not even the same as earths elder gods created by the demiurge and again get over the fact that it shows him with comic panels, that has happened with lesser characters, what he actually does in that scan is wipe out one being from another dimension mostly powered by Billys standard powers and transport a bunch of fodder back through the portal they were right next to. You can continue to delude yourself Wiccan is universal let alone multiversal. It's existence has been retconned hence he has no such feats. Billy joins him at his side, and they play a part in stopping a Cotati invasion of Earth. The Demiurge, isolated, did not behold his mother, nor anyone else, and concluded that only he existed, ignorant of the superior levels of reality. @demiurgekaplan: multiversal demi urge has been debunked, https://comicvine.gamespot.com/forums/battles-7/demiurge-wiccan-vs-hom-wanda-vs-white-phoenix-jean-2159484/. He should curb here. The false other-worldliness of the Gnostics leads to immorality (ch. Wiccan and the others were eventually rescued by their teammates and continued avoiding registration. The etymology of the name Yaldabaoth has been subject to many speculative theories. Having no other choice, Wiccan and the team decide to leave New York. His abilities were first triggered when the Scarlet Witch used her . They insanely overrated wiccan. Acts as a safeguard while the Scarlet Witch and Doom try to access the Earth's Life Force, which is what gave HoM Wanda her powers. He is first mentioned in "The Cosmos, Chaos, and the Underworld" as one of the twelve angels to come "into being [to] rule over chaos and the [underworld]". The team arrived at the Avenger's Tower and with the help of the newly reformed Vision, located additional assistance to rescue Hulkling. At full maturity, a Demiurge is stronger than any Nephalem, including one sired by an Arch-angel/demon and can use their unique powers to kill them with ease except not when one is using its true potential. In this future, he is the Sorcerer Supreme. Comic Vine users. [40], According to Marcion, the title God was given to the Demiurge, who was to be sharply distinguished from the higher Good God. In the Apocryphon of John c.AD 120180, the demiurge arrogantly declares that he has made the world by himself: Now the archon ["ruler"] who is weak has three names. A confrontation with the villain Mr. Hyde led to Wiccan's discovery that Patriot had been abusing Mutant Growth Hormone. Instead, the Young Avengers continued to function as a team, now using Kate Bishop's resources to support them. @stahlflamme: How's he barely universal? It is eventually revealed by Agatha Harkness that Billy and Tommy were subconsciously created by Wanda through the use of Chaos Magic, and cannot exist outside of Westview. In the Apocryphon of John, Yaldabaoth is also known as both Sakla and Samael. This being is considered not only blind, or ignorant of its own origins, but may, in addition, be evil; its name is also found in Judaism as the Angel of Death and in Christian demonology. He and Teddy continue to be in a relationship. He did not do it and he will not do it, because then marvel would have to come up with actual laws for their magic and how does that apply to combat in the first place? In Middle Platonist and Numenius's Neo-Pythagorean cosmogenies, the Demiurge is second God as the nous or thought of intelligibles and sensibles[4] (Middle Platonism and Neo-Pythagoreanism overlapped: both originating in the early 1st century BC and extending through to the end of the 2nd century AD or even into the 3rd century). But Yaldabaoth, the Demiurge, with the material world, will be cast into the lower depths. The user is able to perform/cast a rare variety of magic spells and feats that manipulates reality itself to various degrees. But what he (demiurge) showed or said is less than what raven did in the future state (destroyed: the new genesis, speed force wall, hell). Billy met Iron Lad at the Avengers Mansion while seeking Scarlet Witch. The blasphemous falsity of the Gnostic claim to control the higher powers by magic and the absurdity of their claim to cure diseases by casting out demons (ch. Wiccan was featured in the HeroClix figure game. Doctor Strange has also claimed that Wiccan has the potential to be the next Sorcerer Supreme. Loki's hand is revealed, and Billy is locked in battle with Mother. This sudden outburst of powers worries the Avengers, who think that it may lead to Wiccan having a mental breakdown similar to that of the Scarlet Witch. Plotinus argues of the disconnect or great barrier that is created between the nous or mind's noumenon (see Heraclitus) and the material world (phenomenon) by believing the material world is evil. He is currently engaged to Teddy Altman, aka Hulkling. Back at the Avengers Mansion, Billy was eager to begin Sylvie's training, but she seemed more interested in getting closer to Billy, whom she appeared to be attracted to, causing Billy a degree of discomfort. He wiped out Mother and nothing else. The former was dkaios, severely just, the latter agaths, or loving-kind; the former was the "god of this world",[41] the God of the Old Testament, the latter the true God of the New Testament. To this Messiah, however, was actually united with Jesus the Saviour, Who redeemed men. Unkindness has fewer feats and it took her a whole longer to destroy the multiverse. Attack on the Gnostic doctrine of the making of the universe by a fallen soul, and on their despising of the universe and the heavenly bodies (chs. New Music Friday: The best releases out on March 3 : All Songs Considered The best albums out this week include Kali Uchis' Red Moon in Venus, a self-titled joint from the Jamaican American artist . The true doctrine about Universal Soul and the goodness of the universe which it forms and rules (chs. William "Billy" Kaplan, also known as Wiccan, is a human mutant and magician. That was in America (2017) which is what youre referring to. Coat of Arms refused to leave her team, but Enchantress graciously accepted. She reassured him that "Everyone has some gift," and advised him that next time he encounter Kessler, not to back down. At the close of the series, Billy and Tommy are seemingly cease to exist after Wanda undoes her spell and frees Westview from her control, but the post-credits scene has Wanda hearing the boys calling to her, implying they somehow survived. So am I supposed to repeat the same thing over and over again, too? Level 2: While Wiccan has Mystical Destiny, he will transform into the Demiurge if you have at least 8 AP in all colors. The team continued to fight crime on the streets, including busting dealers of Mutant Growth Hormone, which granted superpowers to ordinary humans. Loki convinces Wiccan to temporarily give him some of his powers, and Wiccan agrees, seeing no other choice. 45). Answer: Wiccan is a powerful magic user with a unique tie to Avengers history. One night, Billy was angry at his father for no good reason, and yelled at him, telling him never to read to him again. So destroying a universe is his best actual feat not his worst. He is a reality warper, according to Loki. It was other people that had a problem with him. Iron Lad had used a system he found in the remains of the Vision which helped locate alternative members for the Avengers for the next generation. A woman jogger passed by and asked him if he was okay because she saw the boy was bleeding. He is an archon with the face of a lion, half flame, and half darkness. Iron Lad explained he needed help protecting himself from his future self, called Kang. A lot of comic books inspired WandaVision, including House Of M and the 1985 The Vision And The Scarlet Witch limited series (by writer Steve Englehart and artist Richard Howell.) When the Scarlet Witch used her powers to recreate the world after the House of M event, she inadvertently recreated both William and Thomas as well. Billy took to her so well that, later, at a Young Avengers meeting, he vouched for Sylvie. like very very gay 2, it is revealed by Loki that Wiccan is destined to ascend to a god-like reality warper who will rewrite the rules of magic known as the Demiurge. His parents openly accepted his sexuality and welcomed Teddy as a member of their family. He IS omniversal. The Demiurge, having received a portion of power from his mother, sets about a work of creation in unconscious imitation of the superior Pleromatic realm: He frames the seven heavens, as well as all material and animal things, according to forms furnished by his mother; working, however, blindly and ignorant even of the existence of the mother who is the source of all his energy. The figure of the Demiurge emerges in the theoretic of Iamblichus, which conjoins the transcendent, incommunicable One, or Source. When Hulkling is hurt during the battle, Billy uses his powers to put the Sons into comas. Being raised in a normal home in New York with his loving mother, Rebecca Kaplan, father, Jeff Kaplan, and two brothers, Billy had the average problems for a gay teenager. In the Platonic, Neopythagorean, Middle Platonic, and Neoplatonic schools of philosophy, the demiurge (/dmi.rd/) is an artisan-like figure responsible for fashioning and maintaining the physical universe. As the full-powered Demiurge, he casually removes Mother from existence, who is an extremely powerful matter manipulator, and removes everyone from the pocket dimension into the main universe. At first, it was presumed that Billy was just an electrokinetic mutant with strong sorcery abilities. He was supposed to have been safely locked away, guarded by the Avengers, but when a recently inverted group of Avengers (Sam Wilson, Scarlet Witch, Luke Cage, Wasp, Medusa, and Thor) went to check on him, they found that he'd escaped. Humiliated and defeated, Osborn ordered the remaining members of his team to stand down, simply stating to the YA that, "This never happened." In Pistis Sophia, Yaldabaoth has already sunk from his high estate and resides in Chaos, where, with his forty-nine demons, he tortures wicked souls in boiling rivers of pitch, and with other punishments (pp. [7] This is the God above the Demiurge, and manifests through the actions of the Demiurge. During the AXIS event, following the Inversion of several heroes and villains on the island of Genosha, the Red Skull was held captive in the Avengers Tower. Billy explained to the woman what had happened and was shocked to see the woman was none other than Scarlet Witch. His origin make it possible that Wiccan is both a mage and mutant. I want to know about that, Who would win between this wiccan and Mr Mxyzptlk cause raven is more powerful than him and Perpetua. Billy gave up his superhero career, being mostly grounded by his parents who urged him to register. But Jerusalem represents the creation or the Creator whom the Jews worship. 2. Last edited on 26 February 2023, at 15:49, introducing citations to additional sources, Learn how and when to remove this template message, Against the Gnostics; or, Against Those that Affirm the Creator of the Cosmos and the Cosmos Itself to be Evil, International Society for Neoplatonic Studies, Dark Mirrors of Heaven: Gnostic Cosmogony, https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Demiurge&oldid=1141744969, This page was last edited on 26 February 2023, at 15:49. The Young Avengers decide to give the newbies a chance, and announce that they will host try-outs, where each Lite member will be teamed up with one or more Young Avengers. The Ophites held that he and his demons constantly oppose and thwart the human race, as it was on their account the devil was cast down into this world. With a thought, he puts a group of bad guys in a coma.
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